Celebrating 10 years! 2007-2017

Devos backs off on student loan forgiveness

For years on JDU I have seen people discussing IBR, loan for trijocker10/29/17
They'll eventually do loan forgiveness to buy younger voters notreallyalawyer10/29/17
Yep, millenials seem to be complaining the most. Someone po trijocker10/29/17
Well I'm in my 40s and have student debt. I've paid off abou notreallyalawyer10/29/17
Here is the problem, right here. It used to be that higher dupednontraditional10/30/17
This is why student loans cannot be discharged in bankruptcy jdcumlaude10/30/17
Trump's base are people who largely didn't go to college or therewillbeblood10/29/17
Can't you say the same about the Democrat base? Look at citi notreallyalawyer10/29/17
Don't make such assumptions about Trump's base. This is patenttrollnj10/29/17
I think it's inevitable, some time soon with democrats contr notreallyalawyer10/29/17
That's not how it works. When we took these loans out, we re guyingorillasuit10/29/17
The people who signed up during the early days relied on not downwardslope10/29/17
OK, but when the feds refi'd your loan (Grad PLUS, etc), the guyingorillasuit10/30/17
My private loans are under 3% right now. For most people who downwardslope10/30/17
Did anyone even read the article? I'm pretty sure this only finklebots10/29/17
Credited. I think people just enjoy getting worked up, regar mrtor10/30/17
The problem with these loans is the interest. I only borrow david6198310/30/17
same here. In fact if you are doing doc review----which is jdcumlaude10/31/17
Curious can you even do this if you've consolidated? I've go notreallyalawyer10/31/17
trijocker (Oct 29, 2017 - 3:01 pm)

For years on JDU I have seen people discussing IBR, loan forgiveness for Public service and various other programs. Now Devos is backing off on forgiveness. Even if you did not attend a for profit school, what if you just attended a low tier law school where job prospects are slim? Guess you just carry around a huge debt until you die, which seems to be the premise of Grisham's Rooster bar, which is a good read, but hits too close to home.

http://www.sacbee.com/latest-news/article181508841.html

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notreallyalawyer (Oct 29, 2017 - 3:07 pm)

They'll eventually do loan forgiveness to buy younger voters. You'll have your taxes raised to pay for it, and then mass suicides of people slaving away for decades, paying off a degree for a career they despise, will be jumping off bridges that they have to bail out others.

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trijocker (Oct 29, 2017 - 5:32 pm)

Yep, millenials seem to be complaining the most.
Someone posted here a few days ago about a nice mid age couple who had several hundred thousand in debt from lower tier schools and they couldn't get work. Yet you never hear about the older folks.

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notreallyalawyer (Oct 29, 2017 - 5:36 pm)

Well I'm in my 40s and have student debt. I've paid off about half of my student loans in 14 years of repayment. 6 more years I'll only have my federal loans left. But the likelihood is high I'm going to need to go back to school just to be able to get a non doc review job that isn't retail.

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dupednontraditional (Oct 30, 2017 - 6:33 am)

Here is the problem, right here. It used to be that higher education was "for life," that "they can never take your education away from you," etc.

Nowadays, you pay an arm and a leg to get in the door of a career, only to have that degree and/or profession depreciate to zero after a decade or two, requiring more edukation. Funny, the loan payments still hang in there...

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jdcumlaude (Oct 30, 2017 - 7:13 am)

This is why student loans cannot be discharged in bankruptcy. typically you take out a loan to purchase something with a market value that serves as collateral on the loan. When you take out a student loan there is no collateral. Furthermore, rather than the borrower building equity in their purchase, they slowly lose it (or has none to begin with in my case).

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therewillbeblood (Oct 29, 2017 - 5:39 pm)

Trump's base are people who largely didn't go to college or who went when it was cheap enough to pay for with a summer job, so they don't care.

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notreallyalawyer (Oct 29, 2017 - 5:53 pm)

Can't you say the same about the Democrat base? Look at cities like Baltimore, Detroit.. What percentage of the populations do you think went to college?

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patenttrollnj (Oct 29, 2017 - 6:01 pm)

Don't make such assumptions about Trump's base.

This is about not obliging the taxpayer to pay for an individual's mistakes.

We all need to live with our mistakes, unfortunately.

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notreallyalawyer (Oct 29, 2017 - 6:18 pm)

I think it's inevitable, some time soon with democrats controlling congress and the presidency, maybe 16 years in the future, they'll forgive recent student loans, screwing over a big percentage of americans, so they win the youth vote. I can envision rage of people who have been slaving away paying off their loans just to see they have to pay more in taxes so that other don't have to repay their loans. Hopefully fewer people will be going to college in the future if democrats stop destrying secondary education, and you don't need a college degree just to prove you are literate. We've completely devalued university education in this country. It costs a fortune, and very few degrees they offer can even get you any kind of work.. Also I think people are going to wish for the days when you could have a job that pays enough to own a home, a car, two kids, on a single income. Liberals may say this is progress, but making life suck isn't my view of progress. Slaving away for the rest of your life isn't any decent way to live your life.

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guyingorillasuit (Oct 29, 2017 - 10:58 pm)

That's not how it works. When we took these loans out, we relied on the existence of these programs. Our schools, which were the beneficiaries of these loans, told us that we can rely on them. Our federal government never told us that these is any threat of these programs disappearing. I believe that IBR is in my master promissory note, anyway, so it can't be taken away without voiding the contract.

If the programs are taken away, we should be able to bankrupt these loans, like we can almost any other debt not backed by the taxpayers. If we bankrupt a trillion dollars of debt, what do you think that will do to the economy?

If you're making a social policy argument, that is fine and dandy, but you have to limit the restriction to those who are taking out loans *after* the disappearance of the programs, not before. This is what they are doing with pensions and social security, for example.

Edit: found a master promissory note on the internet: https://ifap.ed.gov/dlfsheets/attachments/DLPLUSMPNnodatalabels.pdf. Read through it.

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downwardslope (Oct 29, 2017 - 11:07 pm)

The people who signed up during the early days relied on nothing. They did not exist until after they graduated or while they were in school. Most people were still taking out private loans until the Feds started issuing loans directly in around 2009. Before then you had to go through a company like Sallie May and the terms were terrible. 8.5% for gradplus plus something like another 3-4% for origination when private loans were more like 5-7%.

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guyingorillasuit (Oct 30, 2017 - 12:35 am)

OK, but when the feds refi'd your loan (Grad PLUS, etc), there was still a contract that you signed. That contract would have contained terms similar to the master promissory note.

The private loan issue is still out there, without a solution. My guess is that we will resolve by allowing people who qualify to BK those loans. That's how it always was historically, until (I believe) 2005.

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downwardslope (Oct 30, 2017 - 7:54 am)

My private loans are under 3% right now. For most people who got them a while ago (they were not available unless you had good or excellent credit), the rates should be much lower than fed loans.

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finklebots (Oct 29, 2017 - 11:45 pm)

Did anyone even read the article? I'm pretty sure this only applies to the Corinthian college crowd. PSLF and IBR are not affected, at least not yet.

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mrtor (Oct 30, 2017 - 9:05 am)

Credited. I think people just enjoy getting worked up, regardless of whether the issue is even legitimate.

Personally, I don't have much of an problem with the change. None of these failed for-profits were ever a reasonable choice for a rational consumer. The morons who attended them should have a stake in their debt.

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david61983 (Oct 30, 2017 - 8:01 am)

The problem with these loans is the interest. I only borrowed around 80k but am now at like 150k due to the 8% interest rate which is downright criminal. If I could just write a one time check to the gov't for 80k and be done with it I would do so. As such, I'll just stay on IBR and keep making my minimum payment which is currently zero. They can either get something or nothing. They seem to prefer nothing.

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jdcumlaude (Oct 31, 2017 - 9:12 am)

same here. In fact if you are doing doc review----which is considered periodic work---you can sometimes argue your way into 0 payments based on uncertain working conditions...even if you have years making a certain dollar figure---essentially the argument goes like this....IDK if I will be employed for 6 months or 6 days...they give little to no notice of shutdown therefore any payment would be based on uncertain income....it worked for me for about a year.

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notreallyalawyer (Oct 31, 2017 - 9:39 am)

Curious can you even do this if you've consolidated? I've got consolidated stafford loans and private loans.. If I were to have no money, or I went back to school, can I even get deferments or because I'm consolidated for the staffords I cannot?

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