Remembering TCPaul, 2016-2019

Good sign of an interview?

So...as I'm always hunting for better jobs I landed an inter dalocummelioribus02/20/19
It is so hard with interviews because you know what you are persius02/20/19
Yes, that definitely makes sense. In fact she did say she ha dalocummelioribus02/20/19
Remember why they are hiring you. You need to impress upon dingbat02/20/19
This is a good point. I would put it in the thank you note. persius02/20/19
One of the things she mentioned to me about the other potent dalocummelioribus02/21/19
yeah, the big advantage of a young/inexperienced person is t dingbat02/21/19
Yep I agree. I also told her I have a long-term commitment dalocummelioribus02/21/19
OP - your posting history suggests a tendency to engage in a williamdrayton02/21/19
Oh of course, that's what I've been doing - it just seems to dalocummelioribus02/21/19
You don't have a job until someone formally offers you the j pauperesq02/21/19
A fair point, but why would they do all that if they were no dalocummelioribus02/21/19
Of course they're interested. You're right, they wouldn't h pauperesq02/21/19
True. I haven't heard back from her today. What a total was dalocummelioribus02/22/19
It sounds like you gave them every opportunity. They missed persius02/22/19
That's true. I have never worked with a headhunter before, b dalocummelioribus02/22/19
I don't think the kind of work OP does is going to find much wutwutwut02/23/19
Yeah, he’s changing careers, it sounds pretty entry-level. persius02/23/19
Ha! She actually did reach out back to me this morning: " dalocummelioribus02/23/19
If you are looking for a job outside of law you probably wan persius02/23/19
I realize you already heard back, but for the future, I too onehell02/25/19
In a somewhat similar situation I once asked “what do you dingbat02/25/19

dalocummelioribus (Feb 20, 2019 - 2:30 pm)

So...as I'm always hunting for better jobs I landed an interview yesterday. I am BRUTALLY honest in my interviews and it has worked well for me so far. The woman who interviewed me is also the business owner and I explained I did not have specific experience in the tasks she needs but that she should also look at my record (Academic and professional) and that I am really hungry to learn a new career (Which is true). She then tested me on a few tasks I'd need to do daily and that went well. She did tell me she was only interviewing two more people and that they had more specific exp. than I have...BUT...that I should come in today for a 2nd interview and meet the other owner. I did and he was quite nice to me and we chatted. She then said this and I quote exactly:

"OK, I really really like you. I'm torn between you and another person I interviewed yesterday and since unfortunately something came up, I cannot make my decision until Friday. I need to make my decision when my mind is clear and I can be back in the office to think carefully. The other person has more experience in this and knows what to do, but I'm just not sure to be honest because to me other things matter too".

Her assistant introduced me to yet more people and the boss asked me to hang out (if I wanted) so I can shadow and see more tasks being done. I did that...and I did a few tasks myself. She thanked me and said "I should not keep you longer, I am not paying you for your time and that's not fair". I don't mind because I was learning and getting a feel for things, I told her.

My question: based on this, does anyone think I'm actually hired but that she doesn't want to put herself on the spot in case something happens between now and Friday and look impulsive? My impression is that based on the fact they allowed me to hang out for so long (at my will) and do tasks is a very good sign. On the other hand, I never trust anyone until it's on paper and a contract is actually signed. Any thoughts?

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persius (Feb 20, 2019 - 2:49 pm)

It is so hard with interviews because you know what you are capable of and know the interviewer is making a mistake by not hiring you. The experienced person is the safe/cya hire.

I would give you the job if the only experience necessary is knowing what to do and the other person wasn’t a star in their last job. I really wouldn’t care if you had no experience, but if the position requires connections in the industry that only come through experience your odds go down dramatically.

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dalocummelioribus (Feb 20, 2019 - 2:56 pm)

Yes, that definitely makes sense. In fact she did say she has to think about what is "best for the business" vs "what she feels about me". But I think overall I left a good impression (I hope). It's actually a really good deal if they do hire me...a good deal for me I mean in terms of what they offer. Boss lady also mentioned that she had no doubt I could learn the stuff fast and that she could teach me.

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dingbat (Feb 20, 2019 - 10:37 pm)

Remember why they are hiring you. You need to impress upon her that it will be more cost-effective and/or more profitable in the long run for her to hire you

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persius (Feb 20, 2019 - 10:54 pm)

This is a good point. I would put it in the thank you note.

In your own words something about recognizing they would be making an investment in you but that you’d be a tremendous asset to them down the road.

They have to decide whether they want a proven mediocre hire or someone is potentially going to be a star 18 months down the road. Are they willing to take that raw talent and polish it. They know you don’t have any bad habits yet or a bad reputation in the industry.

I don’t know what you’re interviewing store so maybe thinking A little too over-the-top if it is for making sandwiches at subway.

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dalocummelioribus (Feb 21, 2019 - 11:55 am)

One of the things she mentioned to me about the other potential hire is that even though they are experienced, "person is too set in her ways for me to work with comfortably at all times"...she raised this as a potential issue that could be in my favor.

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dingbat (Feb 21, 2019 - 8:21 pm)

yeah, the big advantage of a young/inexperienced person is that they're easier to mold. it's easier to teach someone good habits than to make them unlearn bad ones

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dalocummelioribus (Feb 21, 2019 - 11:52 am)

Yep I agree. I also told her I have a long-term commitment (Which she liked).

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williamdrayton (Feb 21, 2019 - 1:52 pm)

OP - your posting history suggests a tendency to engage in a level of analysis that leads to paralysis.

take it from someone who is likely much older than you (I am very close to getting my AARP card).

you are putting way too much thought into this. up until a few years ago I would wrack my brain dissecting every interview in search of "good signs". after getting burned on multiple occasions, I stopped analyzing them completely.

my advice to you is: get back on the interwebz job sites and complete more applications and send out more resumes. completely forget about that interview as you prepare for the next one. think of yourself as an NHL goaltender or NFL kicker: short memories work best. then be pleasantly surprised if/when you get a job offer

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dalocummelioribus (Feb 21, 2019 - 8:54 pm)

Oh of course, that's what I've been doing - it just seems to me that very few people would go through all the trouble of introducing me to so many people and having me stay a bit at the office if they were not at least REALLY interested in potentially hiring me...but that's just my impression.

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pauperesq (Feb 21, 2019 - 3:13 pm)

You don't have a job until someone formally offers you the job. Having you mill about to meet people and "get a feel for things" doesn't mean jack squat.

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dalocummelioribus (Feb 21, 2019 - 8:55 pm)

A fair point, but why would they do all that if they were not at least really interested? I can tell you that when they are not really interested they would not go through all that...and the interview would be cut short usually.

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pauperesq (Feb 21, 2019 - 9:44 pm)

Of course they're interested. You're right, they wouldn't have done all of that if they weren't. Still doesn't change my point. You don't have a job there yet.

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dalocummelioribus (Feb 22, 2019 - 4:36 pm)

True. I haven't heard back from her today. What a total waste of time and false words toward me.

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persius (Feb 22, 2019 - 6:31 pm)

It sounds like you gave them every opportunity. They missed their chance.

The best is to get as many of them going as you can. Also try and connect with some recruiters (headhunters) in your area on LinkedIn. They know where the jobs are at and they get paid to find you one. Different recruiters will have different connections and be working on different things, So connect with as many as you can.

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dalocummelioribus (Feb 22, 2019 - 6:43 pm)

That's true. I have never worked with a headhunter before, but I will try that.
Thank you.

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wutwutwut (Feb 23, 2019 - 3:32 pm)

I don't think the kind of work OP does is going to find much of a warm reception with recruiters.


I don't know what this potential new job is, but the current job is some sort of paralegal. Recruiters aren't going to get paid for bringing in paralegals (at least, not that I've ever seen), so they're not going to rep them.


That said, they still may give OP some free tips or guidance.

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persius (Feb 23, 2019 - 3:53 pm)

Yeah, he’s changing careers, it sounds pretty entry-level. They should be willing to help him though in terms of giving him pointers and having resources available on their websites. They may also tell him where to look because if he gets an entry-level job three years from now he might be the kind of guy they would rep and he may come back to them.

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dalocummelioribus (Feb 23, 2019 - 10:37 am)

Ha! She actually did reach out back to me this morning:

"We all really liked you, but unfortunately the person who was at the job previously left suddenly as I told you so we have nobody to really sit down with you and train you. We decided to move on with the experienced candidate. If this should not work out, I will reach out to you again. Best"....

At least she's honest.

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persius (Feb 23, 2019 - 3:13 pm)

If you are looking for a job outside of law you probably want to be utilizing Linked in.

This woman has some good videos.

How do use LinkedIn to find a job.

https://youtu.be/Ox_ohqsIMAM

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onehell (Feb 25, 2019 - 5:21 pm)

I realize you already heard back, but for the future, I too have been in the situation where the employer openly tells me they're torn between myself and someone else.

What I said was along the lines of "We've already been through several rounds of interviews and you know what I bring to the table, and you know what the other candidate brings to the table. So I'm not going to make a sales pitch for myself here. I already got to know enough about your company that I care about it and the good work it does, and I know how much you care about it too. So I just want you to do what is best for your business, even if it isn't hiring me. And that's how we lawyers should think. We want the best for clients and prospective clients alike; their interests come first. Same is true for you. I want the best for you and your company, regardless of whether that's me."

The next day, this produced an offer, which I didn't ultimately take, but they seemed to really like that answer FWIW. Conveys that you care about them, and also subtly communicates that you have other options and aren't just desperate.

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dingbat (Feb 25, 2019 - 7:13 pm)

In a somewhat similar situation I once asked “what do you need to hear from me that will convince you I’m the better choice?”

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